This is one rocking post:) Thank you BrettRocketSci for posting and thank you everyone for so much great information. Idiocracy 42, you are far more than a prepper. You are a true survivor. We who are about to take the full plunge salute you!

The very first part of the secret is to make sure you understand what Rand was telling us. She lived the latter part of her life in New York City, and not out in the boonies, even though she and Frank put some effort into trying to grow alfalfa when they lived in California.

If you want to approach subsistence farming and have dairy and meat animals, goats are a lot easier and safer than cattle. You will need to make sure that you have neighbors who also have similar animals so you can avoid inbreeding. Alpine goats, rather than Nubian, are a good choice. Nubians are already too inbred and as my wife says, "Will die if you look at them cross-eyed." For goats you will generally need good fencing so they can be kept out of your vegetable garden. Your garden will also attract deer.

For good off-grid solar-charged electric fencing your best sources are Caprine Supply and Premier1, both of which also have equipment and supplies you need but you would never imagine existed.

If you are seriously interested in making your own woolen clothing you can raise sheep, which can also be good for milk and meat. Learn how to shear according to the Bowen method. That's what those Aussie and NZ shearers use, being able to do an animal in four minutes without nicking the flesh. It'll take you more than an hour, at first, and you'll wound your sheep substantially. Do not expect in the current market for wool to be able to sell the wool for more than what it costs to sharpen the blades of your electric shears. If you want to hand-shear, get a few pairs of Burgon and Ball shears and learn how to keep them sharp. Hand shearing is slower than mechanical, looks awfully dangerous but really isn't, and gives you a closer mutual understanding with the sheep about what you are doing. Look up the Tom Roberts painting "Shearing the Rams" to see how it is done, and do be careful. Never turn your back on a ram, and do not try to make friends with him. Learn to push his head sideways to teach him that you, not he, is in charge of him and his ewes.

There is so much more. Pay some attention to how the Amish do things. Consider having a large family, even though Rand had no children at all except for you and me and zillions like us. Also look up the autobiography of Asa Sheldon. He tells of his joy in working teams of oxen. Here's a good copy of it: https://www.ponyspot.com/asa/asa-shel...

Very good start. We also have extra medications and first aid necessities like antibiotic ointments, aspirin, bandages of all kinds, rubbing alcohol, eyewash, much more. That kind of thing is great for bartering as well.

Thank you very much! 👍

Thank you, Idiocracy42, for taking the time to share all the information in your posts in this topic. Very important to know where to get some of the heirloom seed stock!

Okay, I took a stab at that and posted as separate posts. Hope it helps! Will answer any questions I can.

Herbals/Health

This is a major work in progress for me. Books are my best resource – there is a LOT of nonsense and misinformation on the web. Trusted authors for me are Stephen Harron Buhner, Sam Coffman (his book by far is the best (Herbal Medic – A Green Beret’s Guide to Emergency Medical Preparedness), Rosemary Gladstar. I also have some good foraging books (John Slattery), but those will be local to your area.

The books will help identify what you’d like to have on hand (and are very good at telling you how to use it), you need to figure out what will actually grow successfully in your area and find sources. Like the vegetable seeds, you need to find reliable sellers. For me, the first option is always Strictly Medicinal (https://strictlymedicinalseeds.com/), but there are certainly others. Also check out https://mountainroseherbs.com/.

Figuring out how to get these planted and growing is a bigger effort – I generally do a separate search for each plant, and have to hit several sources to get all the info that I need. The requirements are all over the place – dry, wet, rich soil, poor soil, acid or alkaline, shade/sun, how to stratify, plant, harvest and store. Many of them are good companions in the veggie garden, many are not. Many/most are perennials and once they’re going you get them for free year after year.

Read about herbal antivirals, herbal antibiotics, immune support, how to make tinctures and salves and teas… I really can’t make a decent list here. Start with Herbal Medic and see what interests you.

Vegetable Garden

When looking for seeds, go for heirloom so you can save your seeds for next season. Some trusted sources are Baker Creek (https://www.rareseeds.com/), Brim (https://www.brimseed.com/), Select Seeds (https://www.selectseeds.com/). I’ve been really happy with plants (trees, shrubs) from Stark Bros (https://www.starkbros.com/). There are many others, but do some homework – there are seed merchants that sell old seeds.

Decisions on where to plant – we use raised beds here, along with a number of pots (especially for invasive herbs) and towers for patio areas. Green Stalk (https://greenstalkgarden.com/) has good towers that are really easy to work with; these are great for planting on balconies, etc.

The hardest part on this for me was finding good resources for planting, cultivating, and harvesting all in one place. There are some apps that can help with it (https://www.growveg.com/ and https://www.smartgardener.com/). They provide pretty good info on most common garden vegetables, and both walk you through planting, common insect/disease problems, harvesting and allow you to prepare a garden layout.

Read about planting zones, stratifying, chill hours, hardening-off, companions.

Bonus: Materials (soil amendments, fertilizer, pest treatments, etc.) that have OMRI on the packaging are generally appropriate for organic gardening.

Food Storage

This was really a piecemeal thing for me. You can get some good information from LDS (https://providentliving.churchofjesus...) they have charts that can help with determining how much to store per person. I used that as a sanity check.

Mostly for food storage (the important HOW part), it depends on what you are storing. I use canning, freeze-drying (expensive up front), drying, fermenting, root cellaring (although my root cellar plugs into a wall ☹). Outside of your wheat berries and other grains, your beans, sugar and a few other things, the best option by far for most foods is freeze-drying.

There are several freeze-drying videos/groups out there (Retired-at-40 on MeWe is probably the most popular). I’ve been freeze-drying for a few years and learned mostly by trial and error. There just wasn’t that much depth from trusted resources when I started, but it is pretty easy to figure out what will/will not freeze-dry well.

Read about mason jars, mylar bags, food-safe buckets and oxygen absorbers. The homesteading links above are useful resources for food preservation. There’s also the National Center for Home Food Preservation, which is generally the last word in both technique and safety.

Overall Homesteading

One of the best sources for overall homesteading skills is https://homesteadingfamily.com/
They really walk the walk, and have a wide variety of topics. Plus, they are very good teachers, direct, thorough and to-the-point. When they are on a topic, they go pretty deep. They cover everything from canning and fermenting, to care for cast iron, to gardening and even some animal husbandry. I’d say that almost every topic a homesteader needs to learn is covered to some degree.

I’m also quite fond of https://prepschooldaily.blogspot.com/. She writes a blog every day and you never know what she’ll come up with. She has great sense of humor and I’ve learned a lot of important tidbits from her.

Another good source is https://practicalselfreliance.com/. There are many resources available; just watch out for those who are copy/pasting what they find online/are vague in their posts. Often that means they don’t really know much.

I've joined a few, tried starting a few more. It's hard. Getting people on the same page so to speak. When you have an inspiring leader, it works well. I joined a meetup group arranged around an inspiring leader and it was awesome. When that leader left for personal reasons, the group floundered, fought, rearranged and became a liberal virtue-signaling imitation of the original group's purpose. At least in this case, a strong leader was necessary.

What would be the theme of your meetup group?

Fascinating journey you are taking. Would you mind posting some of the links that you found helpful, please?

There’s no real set-up. I made a plan that starts at the end… what would I like to achieve? For example, if I want to store food, I better know how to do it right. There are a lot of options and some are pricey.

Then, you figure out what food; everyone says beans and rice, but that is no way to live, and certainly no way to maintain a healthy immune system. Personally, I want to have bread and fruit and vegetables and chocolate and coffee. I don’t want a can of something shelf-stable for 25 years. I have to have a rotation plan, and use it daily.

Nobody likes to drink powdered milk, but it might be the only way you can store it. But even powdered it doesn’t last that long, so you learn to cook with it. In most baking, you’d never know the difference, which lets you rotate it instead of letting it go bad.

So, you need to learn how to prepare what you store into meals. As you master that, you can figure out how to grow it, raise it, or buy in bulk. There are a lot of videos online that can help you through the process, including how to grow gardens in limited space like patios, balconies and kitchen counters.

We can’t buy a cow until I’ve mastered dairy. I’ve made butter, yogurt, sour cream, buttermilk and ice cream, but what’s life without cheese? It is on my list, but it all takes time. Once I master the cheese, I still need to learn how to take care of the cow and keep her healthy and well-fed. Her and the bull, I mean :-). Sustainability!

There are certainly upfront expenses, but as you build in the resiliency, you’ll find that you spend a lot less over time, you get to know what you’re eating, and you’re less susceptible to inflation and supply chain issues.

It’s a path though, and for me-the-nerd it has been a lot of research; there’s certainly a lot of bad guidance online. I think it is important to validate and test your outcomes, which means not just buying a bunch of books and seeds, and hoping everything will work out if you ever need it. I suspect that arm-chair preppers might have a tough time if it ever came down to it. Just gotta live the life, which for me is the whole point anyway.

Thanks for that experience. I have been considering creating a Meetup group. I'm thinking that it needs to be very special and unlike any typical Meetup - combining art, food, music, and beauty with every event. A heroic and uplifting experience every time. Also, no whiners or free-loaders or control-freaks allowed! It's easy to dream about this but execution and commitment are a big deal, I'm not ready for that yet.

This sounds like a great situation. Thanks for sharing your progress and success. Congratulations to you! Lack of a garden (and secure land for it) is a major concern for me. But I would value time to learn details about your setup from you. Can we talk directly please?

Thanks for this advice too. But I want to create a permanent sustainable life for myself and my family that does not require eating from canned food for the rest of our lives. I need to create a permanent parallel economy that can provide a decent, even enjoyable, quality of life.

I appreciate the advice. Gun range is probably a good place to start to find like-minded people. What I also don't want to do is live like an off-grid prepper in the middle of civilization. I don't think that's feasible or sustainable.

Not an easy task, but there are certainly steps to take for progress. I started with food, about two years ago when we started homesteading. I wanted to get rid of all convenience foods (make my own) and learn to build a giant pantry - how to store, rotate and use basic ingredients to make nutritious, easy and enjoyable meals. I didn't want to buy pre-made emergency stuff because it is not sustainable.

Now I have a well-stocked pantry that would get us through more than a year, a good producing garden, and go shopping every other month. Except for Azure which delivers most of my organic bulk goods once a month.

I spend far less on groceries than ever. Which has allowed me to work on new projects - the big one is now designing an herb garden and learning to make medicine.

You need books, and to read them now. Medical, farming, homesteading (learning the old ways of getting by without modern conveniences).

I find like-minded people in odd places online. Plus, I married one, so that helps. In my mind, its about creating a resilient environment and finding pleasure in that. I must say it is massively enjoyable to say, 'wow, I never have to buy that again!'

When I am not ticked off by news (as I am at the moment), I generally feel like I live free and happy.

And 150 quart jar equivalent per person as a starter for canning.
Lots of salt, sugar, vinegar and rice as a two year consumption plan.

Nothing can replace written instructions on food storage and medical practices. Lots of books.

I agree with you but have no ideas how. I checked my zip code on this site and there are about 10 people in my area, who joined, and became inactive, immediately, about 6 years ago.

I noticed when I started a Meetup.com group, that tons of people would join the group, many would click Attending, and very few would physically show up. This is a problem...

join a gun range
find people there that are like minded

you need
guns and ammo
food, water, non-GMO seeds
water filters
solar panels and batteries to hold the power
generators, fuel
wood stoves (for emergencies)
night vision

and all the electronics need to be protected from an EMP

as a start