Posted by $jlc 9 years, 9 months ago in reply to this comment.
I beg your pardon? I found an example of modern (at least by my definition - printing press, gunpowder, banking) Christian armies committing wasteful slaughter. If you are going to definitionally eliminate the information I find, I will end this discussion.
That is absolutely true: Read Education For Death, by Gregor Ziemer ~ a first hand account of what Nazi (State) education (indoctrination) was for boys and girls. Written in 1941.
If you truly believe Hitler was a Catholic, simply because he said so, well I guess you also believe that Al Gore Jr invented the internet, simply because he said so too. Hitler was a puppet of his bankster masters, a politician and a most masterful liar. Are you among those who are deceived? Anyways, what does Hitler and his National Zionists have in common with today's terrorists? Hate.
Radical Christians accepted modernity faster than radical Muslims. We can award little gold stars to the religion that modernized first. Not only do I see no constructive purpose in this, pitting the religions of the world against one another is fuel for extremists.
If the extremists have any intelligence, they're keen to make the narrative about outsiders vs in-group rather than law and modernity vs mideval barbarism. Setting up a pointless contest of which religion has the most barbarians in modern times helps the extremist narrative.
As I said, if you believe that Nazism in any way, shape, or form espoused Christianity, you're grossly misinformed. Voluminous data shows catalogues the contrary. In fact, Christian songs were actually rewritten for school children replacing Jesus/Christianity with Hitler and the state. This is not a debatable point but a mater of historical record.
Posted by $jlc 9 years, 9 months ago in reply to this comment.
That is absurd, AG. Christian armies are full of human people, who behave as well or as poorly as humans do under various circumstances. You have asked for an example - the massacre of the city of Magdeburg in 1631 provides an excellent example (per Wiki "Sack of Magdeburg"):
"After the city fell, the Imperial soldiers went out of control and started to massacre the inhabitants and set fire to the city. The invading soldiers had not received payment for their service and took the chance to loot everything in sight; they demanded valuables from every household that they encountered. Otto von Guericke, an inhabitant of Magdeburg, claimed that when civilians ran out of things to give the soldiers, "the misery really began. For then the soldiers began to beat, frighten, and threaten to shoot, skewer, hang, etc., the people." [7] It took only one day for all of this destruction and death to transpire. Of the 30,000 citizens, only 5,000 survived. For fourteen days, charred bodies were carried to the Elbe River to be dumped to prevent disease.
In a letter, Pappenheim wrote of the Sack:
I believe that over twenty thousand souls were lost. It is certain that no more terrible work and divine punishment has been seen since the Destruction of Jerusalem. All of our soldiers became rich. God with us.[8]
And history is full of such examples. I know of no major religion that is exempt. This does not make a religion right or wrong, it just makes it human.
I am happy to have a civil discussion, but not one in which you change inquiry into advocacy and attack. I also suggest you remain on the topic: Christian armies who commit mass murder. Nazi soldiers
What I said was, if you will ever so kind as to read it again, is "You don't have to dig any further than Wikipedia to learn the Catholic church was the #1 church in Nazis Germany"---I did not say that was the extent of my studies.
"Civility is not not saying negative or harsh things. It is not the absence of critical analysis. It is the manner in which we are sharing this territorial freedom of political discussion. If our discourse is yelled and screamed and interrupted and patronized, that's uncivil. ~~Richard Dreyfuss
If Wiki is the depth of your knowledge of history, that explains most of your assertions. You really need to study actual historical documents regarding Hitler and the Nazis. If you did that, you would learn very quickly that Hilter although he was raised Catholic, he grew to despise Christianity. In his rise to power, he banned Christian worship from the public square in favor of worship for the self and the collective/government (much in common with modern liberalism). Hitler did, however, create alliances with leaders of Islam, which is also thoroughly documented.
What about Bolivia? The president gave the pope guy a present of an art piece showing a cross with the ususal communist symbol. Looks to me like, once again, faith and force out to destroy civilization.
He's obviously a fan of "The Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind" a 1976 book by Julian Jaynes. It hypothesizes that until about 3000 years ago our brains hemispheres were functionally separate and one 'talked' to the other providing the 'voice of God'.
An interesting hypothesis and probably one of the coolest book titles ever.
I have rarely read such an incomprehensible statement. It's clear that we do not share the same frame of reference. I need a translator. You might as well be writing in Greek.
I'd review unrevised history if I were you. You'll be surprised how different it is by reading the works of the time, not a hashed up purposed abortion created by bicameral liberal progressives. I took this journey myself, just to see what was there and was properly shocked.
In reality, in a 'Conscious' understanding of Christianity, it is quite the opposite. Although it speaks bicamerally, it documents mankind journey into conscious awareness and points out the tools provided by the consequences of creation and how best to engage it; [regardless of how one supposes it was created.] Once you understand that mankind was not always 'aware' and understand some rudimentary findings in quantum physics you begin to get the big picture. It's not mystical at all, it's self evident...but only to the 'Conscious' mind but sadly requires confidence by the bicameral brain only crowd...sadly, this crowd still exist today and it only confounds the issue further. Islam by contrast is a pure pagan bicameral barbarian view that in effect keeps it's believers from achieving even rudimentary states of awareness.
Hitler said he was Catholic. You don't have to dig any further than Wikipedia to learn the Catholic church was the #1 church in Nazis Germany and figure out the soldiers were Christian. The church (all the way up to archbishop) helped to murder the Jews and the German government collected a tax on behalf of the Vatican and paid the Vatican what was collected. For this I point you to the book "God's Bankers."
History books are wonderful things, and I highly recommend you read some to gain accuracy in your assertions if you believe Christian armies have led the charge to slaughter innocents. To assert that Hitler's army was Christian is to be dangerously uninformed. No one making in the string making the accusation of such Christian armies has provided a single example in modern times (and by modern, I mean since the Crusades, so allows for a pretty good sweep of time).
War, as is used by the media, is defined as by a state or nation with clearly marked uniforms. Terrorists are non state actors.
But that is not accurate. Holy war is declared by Islam, on the world. It's soldiers come from all countries and they are uniform in their belief and intent. We call the Crusades, declared by the Pope, a war not terrorism. Every violent act of "terror" (in the tens of thousands since 2001) by Muslims is a skirmish in the war on the world of non Muslims. So yes it is an act of war. But the "Leaders" and the media are brainwashed by their own Religion of "Tolerance".
Islam is strengthened by their weakness. Every victory encourages them to do more harm. If they are defeated they stop. In their minds everything is the will of Allah. Victory means Allah is saying go defeat means stop.
The S.P.'s decided to change the question in mid denial and focus one one individual. Standard tactic from the Grinch's (formerly Yoda but we thought the naming demeaning to the real Yoda) book Frame The Debate. the Grinch stole the idea from the middle east method of negotiation. Nothing of value unless you are interested in the 2005 assault on Christmas or a student of ACLU tactics.
He followed the Warren Commission Example minus the parts that didn't support the conclusion
Except. This time the only commission was some magical gift the rest of us don't possess. Perhaps one of the Wicked Witches of the left did a Magic Potion #51?
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the early States proved it handsomely. -- j
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Jan
If you truly believe Hitler was a Catholic, simply because he said so, well I guess you also believe that Al Gore Jr invented the internet, simply because he said so too. Hitler was a puppet of his bankster masters, a politician and a most masterful liar. Are you among those who are deceived? Anyways, what does Hitler and his National Zionists have in common with today's terrorists? Hate.
If the extremists have any intelligence, they're keen to make the narrative about outsiders vs in-group rather than law and modernity vs mideval barbarism. Setting up a pointless contest of which religion has the most barbarians in modern times helps the extremist narrative.
This is not a debatable point but a mater of historical record.
"After the city fell, the Imperial soldiers went out of control and started to massacre the inhabitants and set fire to the city. The invading soldiers had not received payment for their service and took the chance to loot everything in sight; they demanded valuables from every household that they encountered. Otto von Guericke, an inhabitant of Magdeburg, claimed that when civilians ran out of things to give the soldiers, "the misery really began. For then the soldiers began to beat, frighten, and threaten to shoot, skewer, hang, etc., the people." [7] It took only one day for all of this destruction and death to transpire. Of the 30,000 citizens, only 5,000 survived. For fourteen days, charred bodies were carried to the Elbe River to be dumped to prevent disease.
In a letter, Pappenheim wrote of the Sack:
I believe that over twenty thousand souls were lost. It is certain that no more terrible work and divine punishment has been seen since the Destruction of Jerusalem. All of our soldiers became rich. God with us.[8]
And history is full of such examples. I know of no major religion that is exempt. This does not make a religion right or wrong, it just makes it human.
Jan
What I said was, if you will ever so kind as to read it again, is "You don't have to dig any further than Wikipedia to learn the Catholic church was the #1 church in Nazis Germany"---I did not say that was the extent of my studies.
"Civility is not not saying negative or harsh things. It is not the absence of critical analysis. It is the manner in which we are sharing this territorial freedom of political discussion. If our discourse is yelled and screamed and interrupted and patronized, that's uncivil. ~~Richard Dreyfuss
You really need to study actual historical documents regarding Hitler and the Nazis. If you did that, you would learn very quickly that Hilter although he was raised Catholic, he grew to despise Christianity. In his rise to power, he banned Christian worship from the public square in favor of worship for the self and the collective/government (much in common with modern liberalism).
Hitler did, however, create alliances with leaders of Islam, which is also thoroughly documented.
An interesting hypothesis and probably one of the coolest book titles ever.
I took this journey myself, just to see what was there and was properly shocked.
To assert that Hitler's army was Christian is to be dangerously uninformed.
No one making in the string making the accusation of such Christian armies has provided a single example in modern times (and by modern, I mean since the Crusades, so allows for a pretty good sweep of time).
But that is not accurate. Holy war is declared by Islam, on the world. It's soldiers come from all countries and they are uniform in their belief and intent.
We call the Crusades, declared by the Pope, a war not terrorism. Every violent act of "terror" (in the tens of thousands since 2001) by Muslims is a skirmish in the war on the world of non Muslims. So yes it is an act of war. But the "Leaders" and the media are brainwashed by their own Religion of "Tolerance".
Islam is strengthened by their weakness. Every victory encourages them to do more harm. If they are defeated they stop. In their minds everything is the will of Allah. Victory means Allah is saying go defeat means stop.
Except. This time the only commission was some magical gift the rest of us don't possess. Perhaps one of the Wicked Witches of the left did a Magic Potion #51?
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