Obama to Jewish leaders: Lay Off The Iran Deal, and I Will Lay Off You

Posted by RanScott 9 years, 8 months ago to Politics
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This is unprecedented in contemporary U.S. Politics.

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  • Posted by term2 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Obama is a very arrogant preacher. The democrats picked him because they felt he could manipulate the populace, which he has. The jews stand up for themselves, as do the russians and even Snowden. Obama hates people who stand up for themselves. HE must be the only one that counts. Maybe its that he is a product of the entitled black culture coddled over the last 50 years? I have to say that I am feeling that way.
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  • Posted by $ jbrenner 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    No, I don't make such an assumption. Freedom is very rare. In those countries where genocides happen, they will happen again when American military leave. Is the American military expected to be there in perpetuity? Only exchange value with those who have to exchange with. I spent some time in East Berlin, long enough to know that totalitarian regimes are not worth investing my time and treasure in.
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  • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    You'll find that those of us who used the De Opresso Liber as the unit motto were rarely used that way by our government. When turned loose to do the job it had a chance of working but that was rarely the case. As for that unit I suggestion the current government as evidenced by the statement of Janet Neapolitano the former head of the protective echelon is far more afraid of them than the reverse. Therefore Obeyme's desire to build them into a force equal or greater in size than the military. No love lost and damn little loyalty there since the unit and the rest of the military took the oath to the Constitution not to Obama. Of course there are the sell outs. ISIS is not some great unbeatable monster that is more hype than reality. But they hold the trump card. The US Government will inevitably fold.The country has no will to win. So why fight and die for a country that isn't worth it when any victory is invariable turned into a loss. Perhaps it isn't your choice anymore. Perhaps a better slogan from the sons and daughters of the nation is "No More Cannon Fodder."
    There is no reset button on the battle field. There are a lot of body bags. Too damn many.
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  • Posted by scojohnson 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    that's an accurate statement...

    all you need to do is survey the nations in the "United Nations" and compare the numbers that are ruled by their people, vs. ruled by a despot. Trust me, we are in the extreme minority... you are talking maybe 30 nations out of the nearly 200 members.
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  • Posted by term2 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    It would appear to me that the rest of the world needs the USA more than the USA needs the rest of the world that might not want to deal with us.
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  • Posted by term2 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I am of the mind now that we cant really afford to continue sticking our noses in the middle east. Put our money into becoming free of the oil there, and get out. If they want us to fight as mercenaries, we could entertain that for a fee. This liberating the oppressed stuff is just getting too much. I am tired of working so Obama can fight in Iraq for which we get nothing except the wrath of ISIS for meddling
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  • Posted by scojohnson 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Hmm... I was deployed to Rwanda and Bosnia during the genocides in each respective location... instead of taking a trip to Toronto and assuming the rest of the world is like that (Canada really just benefits from the US defense of the Western hemisphere), I'd really recommend spending some time in a non-developed country outside of the US sphere of influence and decide if the world would really be better off without us or not.

    You make the assumption that most people are basically good... but history doesn't show that, in fact, freedom is excessively rare. Some 250 years and a handful of countries out of all of the world's history.

    Although I would also argue that the cause of our freedom is an armed populace, not exclusively our military might. Invasion of the US is pretty much impossible, even if we didn't have a military.
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  • Posted by $ jbrenner 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    True, but no country would have millions in casualties anymore without using far more deadly weapons. By comparison, how many people in Canada died? Not many. The financial cost is not anything to be trifled with either. We have literally spent more than a trillion dollars fighting against those with far inferior technology and more than that rebuilding them so that they can destroy it again. At some point you have to ask whether US altruism is really worth it.
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  • Posted by scojohnson 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Wars yes, and numerous yes, but you are talking 4000 to 50,000 casualties in regional engagements, not 1 million+ dead in a world wide theater.

    America took more casualties in a typical morning during the Civil War than we did in all of the Persian Gulf, Iraqi, and Afghan wars.
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  • Posted by $ jbrenner 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Since we ended isolationism, we have gotten into numerous wars and have precious little to show for it. The presumption is that those other markets have something worth accessing. In the case of South Korea, yes, there is some value there. In the case of the Middle East, there is something of value there, but OPEC played us like a Stradivarius in the late 1970s and early 1980s. Now that oil prices have dipped precipitously again, watch out. History could well repeat itself. The looters have told us for decades about the horrors of isolationism. When have the looters been right about foreign policy before?

    As for the isolationism and WW1, there really wasn't a significant national interest there. That was largely a waste. Regarding WW2, it wasn't the isolationism that got us involved. It was FDR himself. We knew the Japanese were going to attack. In fact, some people have argued that we invited them to attack. The only surprises were when and where.
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  • Posted by scojohnson 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    That's called the isolationism that led to WWI and WWII...

    As the only remaining superpower, it's rather unlikely to be completely closed-off from the world, and to a large extent, our military presence guarantees economic access to markets...
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  • Posted by $ MichaelAarethun 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Actually it was a vote of the United Nations this time around. There were two types. De Jure and De Facto. The first means because it was the right thing to do. That was enough to pass the proposal with Russia out of the picture and not present to veto. The second means because they are there. in fact. That's the vote cast by the United States. Never could figure out why Jews supported Democrats either. Demos root philosophy is the same one that ran pogroms and death camps. But then go figure Markx and Engels were Jewish themselves. I've heard several explanations.

    However the last comment is let them work it out with their neighbors. Which means stay out of the way when the ultimate argument is exploded. Unfortunately or fortunately take your pick it became our business when the US policy became stick your nose in and then head for the horizon. Another way of saying depends on whose in power in DC. It sure isn't morals, values and standards.
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  • Posted by term2 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I think its really none of our business. Its time for them to work it out with their neighbors. Why do we have to settle all these issues around the world at our expense?

    We should concentrate on making our own country strong so we have a good life instead of getting tangled up in so many foreign affairs that have nothing to do with domestic security of our country.
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  • Posted by scojohnson 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I don't think they ever abandoned the area, there has been a Jewish presence there in perpetuity, just not a sovereign nation.

    I think the angst is because the West supported the creation of a Jewish state, but not a Palestine one.
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  • Posted by term2 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I have to admit I dont know the real history of Israel, but I thought it was the land of the jews until they were run out probably by muslims a LONG time ago. Then they dispersed around the world. For some reason people in general didnt like the jews and they were persecuted- with that culminating in the NAZI era. After Hitler was defeated, the jews got a bit tired of being not wanted in poland, germany, etc and started to move back to Israel. But Britain was in charge of Palestine at the time (strange in itself...) and THEY gave half the territory to the jews and let them return from wherever they were. The arabs who were there and displaced then hated the jews and that hatred continues to today. Meanwhile the jews are tired of having nowhere to go and be jews (understandable). The problem is that its been over 50 years and the standoff is being enabled by the USA, with no end in sight. At some point, the jews have to make peace with the neighbors of wherever they go, or face extinction. I feel for the jews, BUT there is a limit on how much we can afford to support them just because their religion tells them its "home".
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  • Posted by strugatsky 9 years, 8 months ago
    "The meeting was very emotional, everything was out on the table.” -- Obama admitted to being a Muslim terrorist?
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  • Posted by scojohnson 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    We already have alternative energy, we have a generally low-earning populace of at least 50% of the country that can't afford an 'old' gas car, let alone a new electric one.

    The Israelis have as much claim to the land as anyone else, it was Jewish areas long before it was established as a sovereign nation. Personally, I think they should be given credit for co-existence that they do "do" in terms of being the only place a Palestinian can get a job in the Middle East, rather than continuously demonized. They have ample reason to not trust Muslims, I don't either. Past performance is the best indicator of future expectations... we had a saying when I used to do business in the Emirates "The only reason Allah has the sun rise tomorrow is to renegotiate contracts you signed yesterday."
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  • -3
    Posted by term2 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    If we put the money we waste in land wars in the middle east and help for Israel to be in a place they are not welcomed by millions, we could develop alternative energy and forget the middle east
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  • Posted by wiggys 9 years, 8 months ago
    I just took the time to read some of the article. So according to 0 the Jewish community of the USA and the the nation of Israel are the war mongers here. The fact that Israel has done nothing but defend themselves for all the years of their existence does not enter the brain of 0 why because it is flat like a q-ball. If I recall the more ridges etc. the brain is composed of the more intelligent one is. Imagine being threatened by someone with your life you strike back hard and swift. It is my hope that the congress of the USA will not only reject this deal but will soundly over ride his veto. 0 has continued to demonstrate how utterly stupid he is.
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  • Posted by Temlakos 9 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Aren't we talking about that here? What else does "lay off Iran and I will lay off you" mean?
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  • Posted by term2 9 years, 8 months ago
    We should impeach Obama and leave THAT as his legacy. He is an idiot and the worst president the country has ever had
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  • Posted by scojohnson 9 years, 8 months ago
    Why? They have "the Obama" right where they want him.

    This thing is going to be used for toilet paper.

    We have no interest, necessity, or willingness to "make nice" with Iran. They stormed our embassy and held hundreds of Americans hostage for half of Wimpy's (Carter's) failed presidency.

    There is no need to negotiate with them, yes, at some point we're looking at another land war in the Middle East - but this deal does nothing to stop that, and if anything only better-arms Iran.

    Those nut-jobs have been fighting each other for a millennia over whose flavor of Islam is better. Letting them get nuclear weapons and their money back isn't going to change that...

    We need to stand with our all-weather allies in the region.

    This jackass in the White House is an absolute disgrace. It's why we shouldn't elect people that have never served in the armed forces, you tend to get this crap every time. It's about "honor". Snapping a salute in your 20's, or smoking a joint... which one is the better adult?
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