Quite correct.

You don’t seem to be aware of how 792 ocean-crossing American Privateers in the American Revolution captured over 3,100 British ships. Here’s how PAYEhome.irg/history and 523 did it again in the War for Free Trade and Sailors’ Rights.
You can have subscription defense, and corporations can pay for their own mercenaries. See HowTheNeoConsStoleFreedom.com

See Human Investments in the free market PAYEhome.org and HousingTheAmericanDream.com so everyone can have medical care in the free market. No it’s not impossible Rigid Installment Payments (RIP) & Strip of Equity nor Rigid Installment Premiums.

Now that's a good point I hadn't considered. Exemptions are easy, but they can be a slippery slope. I'll have to think on it.

jsw - That would include the military. Maybe give them a credit of $200,000 (or what ever the JAG manual puts as a value on a death of a service member) for putting their life on the line,

Atlas Shrugged is not about "having a dollar", it is about using your mind and not mooching off of others (the bum on the train for example). Perhaps you should read it.
And as for your SSI remark "but we paid into it"... no, we have been stolen from by thieves. We have not sanctioned the theft, so if and when we get a chance to recoop some of OUR earned money we will do so. You're lack of understanding of objectivism is screamingly obvious.
"Government payment"... the government doesn't MAKE any money, it only STEALS money from the earners to redistribute to others who haven't earned it. At the moment this is still a free country (well, sorta) so if you want to help the 'less fortunate' you can still choose to do so of your own volition, but forcing others to 'help' is stealing via force. I'm surprised someone who thinks they're so rational would be in favor of either one of those methods: stealing, or force, yet YOU are sanctioning both with what you're saying. So YOU'RE the one who needs to be stopped. You're a minion to the thugs and they're ALREADY 'out of control'.

And being logical is not "pathetic", but denying logic sure is.

You are certainly welcome to believe what you wish, but you will find a decidedly unsympathetic audience on this forum for emotional pleas. Those are the realm of the knee-jerk liberals. This forum is for people who use their intellects first and foremost. If all you have are emotional arguments, you have already lost.

Regarding your rant about Medicare et al, answer me this: Am I the steward of the Government's money, or are they a steward of MY money?

The argument has nothing to do with judging. The facts are that people AREN'T the same - either in talents, circumstances, physical appearance, abilities, or anything really. The attempt to force equality is spawned by someone who rejects the primacy of the individual. Can people of their own free will and choice do things to help their fellow man? Absolutely. But government coercion is not an acceptable principle to anyone who values the individual.

Want an example? Try Communist China. In their revolution, they quelled dissent by slaughtering more than 20 million people. Now they merely repress a billion. Countless millions have been terrorized by the State - forced abortions, political prisoners, no freedom of thought, etc. You want that - you are free to move to China.

Don't like China, you can try other oppressive regimes such as Cambodia, Russia, Cuba, North Korea, or anywhere in the Middle East. You truly have no idea how good you have it here in the United States.

Unlike some Gulchers, I would actually be willing to give veterans substantial bonuses in terms of their votes. A veteran's vote should be worth more than someone else's, but we would have to figure out how much that their votes are worth relative to the taxes paid, etc. I was being quite serious and not trying to be offensive. I am not ashamed of myself and have nothing to be ashamed over. Thank you for protecting our investments in America from foreign enemies. If only we could protect our investments from the domestic enemy in chief ...

Oh, why can I only give one thumbs up for this?

Because the government shouldn't be doing it in the first place. James Madison argued vehemently against it when he was President, and I believe the same thing: it is not the duty of the government to extort money from some (taxes) to give to others. It doesn't matter how noble the cause nor how dire the need. Charity can not be forced.

The hard fact of life is that life is hard. We all die. We all encounter hardships. You can't do everything. Are these situations sad? Sure. But it is an act of pure hubris first to assume that every single sad act can be avoided and another to assume that government has the right and obligation to do something about it.

Advertising is for what purpose? To encourage consumption. Why would you encourage the consumption of welfare services using MORE taxpayer money you've taken from the producers? You are encouraging the growth of a socially destructive mindset that living off others is okay - and even sanctioned. That type of mentality is so morally defunct not even Christians like myself support such.

Any of the objectivists here in the forum would tell you flat out that noone is responsible for taking care of (or giving charity as they would put it) for anyone else. You're trying to use the sympathy ploy and it is a logical fallacy.

I'm not an Objectivist 100%, so I'll just say this: there is an avenue for people to assist others in need, but the government is the absolute WORST method by which to do anything. And I mean that from both a means and end perspective.

Are there people who need help? Assuredly. But let's first examine WHY they need the help in the first place. That's easy: high taxes and crushing regulations BY THE GOVERNMENT have reduced the abilities of entrepreneurs to open and run small businesses - the core of the economy. You want to help people, get the government off their backs and let them help themselves. Don't make them MORE dependent on government!

And BTW - I was just in Wal-Mart the other day watching the person in front of me buying stuff with food stamps. If that was an example of a typical food stamp recipient, then the perception is entirely justified.

What the hell are you talking about? Do other people here normally allow you to shoot off on a tangent? All of what you written has *NOTHING* to do with what we were discussing, even if it was a horribly bad and poorly done attempt to garner sympathy for being a poor, downtrodden civil servant that has nigh guaranteed job security and +50% compensation over private industry.

Post a real reply on topic, and you'll get one back.

Winters are a problem here. But if it ever did come down to a survival/self-sufficiency situation, there are plenty of resources. And we're far enough from any major city (Duluth doesn't really count) to have to worry about being overrun by refugees.

I can think of several warmer places that would suit me just fine but for the moment....this is cheaper, which suits my current purposes.

Convert welfare to jobs program, in collaboration with the private sector such that Government NEVER competes with the private sector. Either the jobs come from the private sector seeking to fill low-end positions or they are Government programs to work doing things industry won't address (like sanitation, street cleaning, etc.). Make the Government provide a clear accounting of the functions they provide (real costs including their oversight), and let industry continuously police the cost to displace the Government role. (These thoughts are just a responsible person's acid trip, so it will never happen).

Ya know... I have to disagree...

I have yet to see a fire department refuse to fight a fire because "fees weren't paid". Except the few instances of "privatized" departments. And they got their butts sued off.

And a government that exists to provide Police is, indeed, a scary prospect, an experiment I believe they tried in Eastern Europe and are still trying thanks to our ubiquitous Department of Homeland Security... I'm not sure that is very successful toward the prospect of freedom.

Benefits? From Texas to California to New York, Civil Servants are being required to pay for their benefits, not unlike their cohorts in private industry. Oh yeah, lets not forget EVERYONE pays under Obamascare.

On top of that - a WELL RUN business can offer Profit Sharing, stock options, or bonuses to their employees, which is not available to the Civil Servant. And when an employee rocks, they can get a bonus. Or an immediate raise. Or an immediate promotion based on merit. Gub'mint employees - no way.

And to say that no one who is a Civil Servant does anything like real work is like saying brown haired people are shifty, lazy, and criminals. Not only non-objectivist, but pretty darned ignorant.

So go tell a cop that since you pay his salary, quit writing that ticket and go back to eating your donut. Or telling that fireman who's saving your kid from your burning home that he and the guys putting the fire out are just worthless civil servants. Or laughing at the memorial service for a killed highway worker because, well hell, he was just out there fixing roads so you can get to where you need to and got ran over by a drunk. Too bad the county paramedic who went out there to try to save his life got killed, too, but hey... they weren't *real* people anyway. They were just Civil Servants. Sponges on society. Yeppers.

So... tell me a fact-based non-BS rumor inspired butt joke about civil servants. Here's one - Why did the toll taker risk her butt and step into live traffic to give CPR to the stranger having a heart attack? Another? You heard the one about the Port Authority Employee whose job hit bottom on 9-11? Ha ha ha... that's a riot! Why did the sewer plant maintenance guy go day in and day out to a literally s#!tty job? Then there's the one about the teacher in Columbine, got his butt shot off... naw, that's a dead issue, never mind.

Good jokes, huh? Too bad they're not too funny - then again, real life rarely is, for those who face reality on reality's terms.

Great Non-Sequiturs. There are private Sewage Treatment Plants, and privately owned highways. There are privately owned trash companies. And they do great. As for privately owned Fire Companies, no need. Government run Fire Companies currently deny service to those that haven't paid their fees. But police are one of the sacred reasons why a Government exists. They are there to catch criminals. They aren't there to protect you.

And all of Civil Servants earn MORE than their private business counterparts. When you count benefits, on average, Government Employees earn 50% more than the rest of us. They deserve to be the butt of jokes, and anyone who makes a "living" off the government shouldn't be allowed to vote.

Yes--Iron Range area. Not a bad place to go Galt, but most of the populace seems to have one racket or another going. In a sense that makes it easier to "hide in plain site". If you live quietly, have anything resembling a "job" (am self-employed but volunteer at the Salvation Army for appearance's sake), and don't get on the wrong side of the wrong people (which I will admit can be difficult)....you're invisible.