IMMIGRANT

Posted by Herb7734 6 years, 8 months ago to History
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By now, we are all familiar with the problems faced by America relative to illegal immigration. But, there was a time, early in the 20th century,
when immigration was welcome and sought after, with many square miles to fill. Just about all you needed to do in order to be an immigrant was was to be healthy enough to remain vertical. If you saw the beginning of "The Godfather Part 2" you got a pretty clear picture of Ellis Island. In Poland and Russia Jews were were confined to "shtetles" ( Little States) within or nearby a city. Unless they were either professional men, land owners,or shopkeepers who dealt in necessities (butchers, bakers, food suppliers , etc.) they were so poor that many of them literally starved to death.This is about my Grandfather on my mother's side.

My Grandpa, Manus (Mike) Sherman, his wife and daughter live just outside of Lublin the 4th largest city in Poland in what we call today the Ukraine. He was a non commissioned officer in the Polish army., from which he defected at the outset of World War 1.He changed his name in order to keep from getting caught.and his passport wouldn't sound any alarms because he stole the I.D. off of a dead soldier. It's about this part where I tell you a couple apochryphal stories that circulated among immigrants.There were dozens of themand here are just two: Jews hated the army. In those days, they had good reason to. They had no loyalty to the repressive country in which they lived and they were treated even worse in the army than they were as civilians.

At Ellis Island many of the men, especially those from Germanywho were fleeing the Kaiser's conscription were loathe to give their real names, and on one day they decided to all say "Ich fergessen" (I forgot.) The closest to that in the ears of a minimally educated official, was "Ed Ferguson." That day a hundred or so Ed Fergusons passed through Ell Island. Here's another one:: Before going on permanent AWOL many would steal the wallets of the dead soldiers, not for the money, but for the I.D.Hence our new family name on my mother's side became Shermann, the second n getting dropped when Grandpa got ajob.Another great incentive was that Ford was paying $5 a dayand once the rumor was confirmedyou couldn't hold back half of Europe from immigration. $5 was a month's income in Poland.

"Mike" had a few bucks saved up from many years of manual labor so he traveled to Detroit, where he got a job in construction, building the Rackham Memorial Building, a Marble palace in the cultural center which also contained the Institute of Arts and the Main Library, also marble clad masterpieces.During this time my mother developed rickets from malnutrition so, her mom sent her to live with her parents who owned a small farm. For the first time in her young life, she was able to eat decent food and lots of fresh vegetables and eventually she grew strong but never achieved what should have been her full height.Grandpa told me that he couldn't believe his good fortune. To be able to live a life that Americans took for granted. He got hired at Ford making more money than he ever imagined.Enough to pay rent, clothes, food, and even some to save.He loved Amerca and learned English as quickly as he could so he could become a citizen. By his accent some would call him Russian(same as A.R.'s). "I can tell by your accent tht you are Russian." His back would stiffen up and he'd look the person in the eye and say, "Not Russian, American!" While he was proud to be an American , he still retained some old country habits. He drank only Corby's whiskey when indulging because it was the cheapest rotgut. He also like Slivovitz, a very potent plum brandy. It was said that after uncorking the bottle, the fumes alone would make you drunk. He loved caviar. Not that expensive blsck stuff that you daintilly put on crackers, but the orange fish eggs that you could smell 2 blocks awa when he opened the jar.And that's the difference between 1920 and 2018. Every family had its own stories of coming to America. I have just skimmed the surface. I have had the good fortune of being 1st or 2nd generation depending on which side you look at. As I was growing up, I heard various aunts uncles and, of course, parentstell me how lucky I was to be born in America.They were right.
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  • Posted by ewv 6 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    A handful of cowardly anti-Ayn Rand conservatives still troll this forum, lashing out by "downvoting" facts and Objectivist principles that clash with conservative dogma. No one should be "flummoxed" that they can't defend their position and their behavior.

    When Ayn Rand was asked at the Ford Hall Forum in 1973 about the conservative protectionist position on immigration -- “What is your attitude toward immigration? Doesn’t open immigration have a negative effect on a country’s standard of living?” -- she answered:

    "You don’t know my conception of self-interest. No one has the right to pursue his self-interest by law or by force, which is what you’re suggesting. You want to forbid immigration on the grounds that it lowers your standard of living — which isn’t true, though if it were true, you’d still have no right to close the borders. You’re not entitled to any 'self-interest' that injures others, especially when you can’t prove that open immigration affects your self-interest. You can’t claim that anything others may do — for example, simply through competition — is against your self-interest. But above all, aren’t you dropping a personal context? How could I advocate restricting immigration when I wouldn’t be alive today if our borders had been closed?"

    That has been cited on this forum several times. The protectionists reject the rights of the individual as based on the nature of human beings, replacing that with a forced tribalist affinity.
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  • Posted by ewv 6 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Not violating the rights of individuals is not a matter of generosity and Trump's wife has nothing to do with it. The problem begins with what is legal and what is prohibited and obstructed. Immigration laws are a nightmare of bureaucracy, prohibitions and unnecessary expense coupled with irrational exemptions and non-enforcement. Conservatives do in fact trash immigrants and demand protectionist restrictions. Mark Levin does that constantly.
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  • Posted by DeangalvinFL 6 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    In fact, I just gave it an upvote.
    That I disagree with what I believe to be an exaggerated sentiment in the post does not mean that I am against the posting.
    I respect anyone's thoughtful commentary on this site.
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  • Posted by DeangalvinFL 6 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I didn't down vote anything. Not my style.
    I gave a respectful reply.
    Just want to clarify since my reply is directly below the posting.
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  • Posted by DeangalvinFL 6 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I respectfully disagree with you that "trashing immigration is rampant". Trump himself is married to an immigrant.

    And current "protectionist limits", as you describe them, are the most generous in the entire world. More legal immigrants are welcomed into the USA than any other country on earth.

    The problematic issue is differentiating between legal immigration and non-legal entry/residency.

    Please see: https://www.galtsgulchonline.com/post...
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  • Posted by Lucky 6 years, 8 months ago
    Herb- I enjoyed your stories. I have heard a different form, now what would be the Yiddish for
    'I do not understand'?
    Very interesting comments from everyone tho' I am flummoxed by down-voting of some comments by ewv.

    Now I m going to piggyback on your thread by giving another story (not personal, from the net)-
    -- --

    1961, London Airport Heathrow

    Two people arrive after a long flight, Man woman, husband wife. No particular education or skills.
    In his pocket the man has a £1 note. They quickly find work in factories and driving buses.
    After a few years, they move to Bristol. They take a small shop in Stapleton Road - a poor and rough area.
    They live in a small two-room flat above the shop.
    The shop sells womens' clothes, the woman is now a seamstress.
    The people who know the man call him Mr Night and Day-
    the shop seldom closes, he never seems to sleep. They work. There are five sons.
    The man tells his boys at the time when there were many big strikes-
    "If they want to earn more, why don't they work harder?".
    Now, one of the sons is a financial adviser. Another is a property tycoon.
    Another, after a commended career in the navy, is Senior Superintendent of a police district.
    The oldest died this year, he was head of a big supermarket chain.

    The second son-
    At school, the careers adviser told him "Stapleton Road kids don't go to University"
    He went to university. Studied economics and politics.
    On graduation, he went for interviews in the City. He said "I could see that my face did not fit".
    He got a job with Chase Manhattan in New York. Did very well.
    Then went to Deutsche Bank when after a few years he became MD of their Singapore office.
    When he left, his salary was about £2.5 million a year.
    Noted by colleagues for brain and energy and being good to work with.
    He left Deutsche Bank, returned to UK, entered politics, elected to Parliament.
    Admires Margaret Thatcher and Ayn Rand, a staunch supporter of Israel, supports Brexit.
    Describes Momentum, the cult behind Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn, as neo-fascist.

    Current job- Home Secretary, responsible for the Home Office - police, security, immigration.
    Birth place – Rochdale.
    Hair color – none, head and face clean shaven.
    Religion- “I do not practice any religion”.
    Appearance - trim.
    Skin color – brown.
    Original nationality and religion of parents - Pakistan, Islam
    Name - Sajid Javid
    -- --
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  • Posted by ewv 6 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Conservative protectionism in trashing immigration is rampant. It is quite hostile towards immigrants. They openly insist on protectionist limits.

    The hopeless bureaucracy obstructing immigration through expensive legal fees, arbitrary race-based quotas (now against Europeans), and long artificial delays create an incentive for illegal immigration. Almost no one is talking about that. Most of what we hear is the false alternative of 'open borders' versus protectionism.

    Immigration should be addressed logically now through ending both current artificial obstructions against normal people and the open border anarchy allowing all kinds of criminals, gangs and welfare seekers. That would end a lot of the sympathy towards illegals -- except for those who want illegal immigration to provide entitlements to third worlders at our expense.
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  • Posted by DeangalvinFL 6 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Perhaps.
    But the current issue is dominated by illegal immigrants Knowingly coming in.
    If that could be stopped then the issues of legal immigration could be addressed logically.
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  • Posted by ewv 6 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Anti-immigrant doesn't necessarily mean against all immigration. A lot of conservatives are hostile to immigrants, legal or not, and advocate limits and quotas for protectionism under "legal immigration".
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  • Posted by $ Olduglycarl 6 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    It's nice that you got to hear those stories, mine were second hand. My grandparents on my fathers side had passed before I was born. My fathers older sister was my favorite aunt though...she passed in 05 at 95.
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  • Posted by 6 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    One thing Grandpa could do is swear like a factory worker, which he was. You should have heard him after reading the newspaper. "Herbie tell me, how come such a wonderful place has such @#$#@ idiots running it?"
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  • Posted by 6 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    So.....the purser (captain) asked my mom where she was going and she told him Michigan. In German and Yiddish, a crazy person is a "Mishuga" and a flock of them are "mashuginas" And used as a direct object it's "Mishagoss."W'e're going to Michigan." THe purser making a joke, Michigan? Oh yeah, that's where they put all the mashuginas." She went crying to her mem that they were going to the land of the crazies. It took her a while to dispell her fears, after all, he was the captain.
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  • Posted by $ TomB666 6 years, 8 months ago
    Thank you for the story.

    My father's parents came from Ireland in the 1880's. He 'escaped' because he was a Catholic in northern Ireland and one of the trouble makers. He settled in St. Louis at first. Grandma's family had a 'farm' in county Limerick and her father managed to bring them to St. Louis also where she and Grandpa met. BTW, the farm was about the size of a normal middle class lawn (maybe 100x200) and the family numbered 8 so it was hard to make a living.

    As a youngster I romanticized about St. Paddy's day, etc., but when I ask my father about being Irish, he said we were Americans. End of discussion.

    At the time my grandparents came over (1880s) help wanted signs in New York said "No Irish Need Apply" which may explain how they came to St. Louis. Looks like there has always been some group that was discriminated against ;-)
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  • Posted by $ Olduglycarl 6 years, 8 months ago
    The telling of my Grandfather's and Grandmother's story was never told, so I don't know why they came to America from Sweden in the 1890's but I am sure it wasn't nearly an act of hope and desperation of yours. However, They appreciated America just as much. My Grandfather Carl was a painter in Boston and could pick up any musical instrument and play anything by ear.
    My Grandmother died during the Flue epidemic and My Father and his sisters were separated for a while; my father shipped off to a rich estate and taught landscaping...something he taught me as a kid.
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  • Posted by 6 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    You might notice that I didn't deal with illegal immigration. It wasn't an issue back then, and everyone is aware of the problems of today.
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  • Posted by 6 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Trying to point out the difference between immigration circa early 20th century versus 21st century. I didn't mention Mexico because it was not relevant back then. The influx from Europe was massive, . So, while I was at it, I thought that some immigration tales might add to the amusement or at the very least allow for a bit of background insight. Immigration tales could easily fill a book.As an example, my mom was around 9 when she was aboard the ship from Bremen to New York. A purser brought hot chocolate on deck. My mother had never tasted chocolate, or anything that sweet. She immediately became addicted and came back again and again and running to the bathroom in between. She called him "Captain" and he was amused and kept indulging her.
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  • Posted by Dobrien 6 years, 8 months ago
    "He loved America" "He was proud to be American" that is what is lacking in many of today's Muslim immigrants. Thanks for the tale.
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  • Posted by DeangalvinFL 6 years, 8 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Almost nobody I know is anti-immigrant. Rather, they are anti illegal immigrants or fraudulent asylum seekers.
    The USA accepts in the most legal immigrants of any country on earth. We are an immigrant welcoming country.
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