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I Beat A Patent Troll And You Can Too

Posted by Zenphamy 10 years, 1 month ago to Technology
75 comments | Share | Flag

So, I responded to their demand that we pay up or shut down with this:

Without knowing anything about the legitimacy of either side of this particular patent battle, I found this story pretty amusing as well as a good Objectivist lesson.


"Dear Piece of Sh*t,

We are currently in the process of retaining counsel and investigating this matter. As a result, we will not be able to meet your Friday deadline. After reviewing this matter with our counsel, we will provide a prompt response.

I will pray tonight that karma is real, and that you are its worthy recipient,

Chris

While my wording may have been extreme, the message got through. Needless to say, we quickly found ourselves in federal court. They asked to settle, and I told them my offer was $0 and they would need to license their entire patent portfolio to all other startups, or we would go on the offensive and invalidate their entire intellectual property portfolio"


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  • Posted by khalling 10 years, 1 month ago in reply to this comment.
    I'm glad there was somewhat of a happy ending for both sides! I live near a jerk who charges $5.00 for "movie night." These are movies that are still in the theater....ah...just no.
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  • Posted by khalling 10 years, 1 month ago in reply to this comment.
    sure. agreed. but many on this post are jumping up and down like this is a pervasive problem and ruining industries. We've been on both sides of the coin. Clients pursued by those with dubious claims and also letting people know when they have taken advantage of patent holders. My point is, the statistical data on these cases does not match the outrage. Where is the objectivity?
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  • Posted by Herb7734 10 years, 1 month ago
    When I was publishing graphic bios of R n R stars several of them sued my company for copyright infringement. As our company was underfunded and new we knuckled under. But as we grew and succeeded the next one to try us was confronted by a patent lawyer. The upshot was that a federal judge said that we were protected by the 2nd Amendment and they had no case. Since they were well-known national figures, they had no expectation of privacy. Actually they should have been praising us, because unlike many publishers who were only interested in the lurid and outlandish, we simply told the truth in graphic novel form. Our research was extensive and very complete, managing to portray the essence of a person in 32 pages. Mega stars such as the Beatles & Elvis required 5 editions. Once the dust settled several of the subjects became our friends.
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  • Posted by davidmcnab 10 years, 1 month ago
    It's times like this that I truly regret not having taken that free actuarial studies degree course when it was offered to me. There is a definite gap in the market for "patent troll insurance".

    Nice story, well-related to the timely issue of bully-busting. It beautifully encompasses the problem of patent trolls and their effect on startups.

    @dbhalling, you challenged me recently to produce evidence of poor-quality patents being used to bully software developers. Here you go, this is exactly what I was talking about from the outset.

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  • Posted by khalling 10 years, 1 month ago in reply to this comment.
    I understand about fraud. Are you suggesting that anyone who enters into a patent law case and loses their case has committed fraud?
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  • Posted by $ jlc 10 years, 1 month ago in reply to this comment.
    Yeah...true, but still a great statement. Even if karma is not real, it is a good metaphor.

    Jan. poetically inclined
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  • Posted by dbhalling 10 years, 1 month ago in reply to this comment.
    Your confidence is a little higher than mine, however I trust a jury more than I trust a judge.

    This does not prove that the plaintiff was necessarily unreasonable in asserting the patents however.
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  • Posted by $ allosaur 10 years, 1 month ago
    I learn something new every time old retired dino visits the Gulch. (I only discovered Ayn Rand when the AS movies came out).
    I had already found what I knew about all the parasites out there to be very disturbing.
    This is a whole new additional division of evil people I up until now did not know about.
    All the more disturbing. Like there's a huge horde of mosquitoes out there.
    It brings into question the view that people in general are essentially good.
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  • Posted by woodlema 10 years, 1 month ago
    I have been in similar situations, the only difference is I do not drop it. I immediately return the favor and sue them for anything I can dream up using the freshly won decision as proof that THEY were attempting fraud. I believe in not just defeating the enemy but completely crushing them into nothingness.

    This past weekend I had a phone call from 360-761-1155. they claimed to be with the IRS and were demanding payment for a 2008 - 2012 tax issue. While I did have a 2008 - 2012 issue this was fully resolved. I asked for their employee id's. told them I would get back to them. I called back got another person who used another name and ID number, totally wrong number of digits for an IRS employee. I traced the call to its source in the state of Washington the owner and address, called the local police, called and emailed the IRS< called and emailed the FBI with a TON of information I collected. When I call that number now all I get is busy signal...I guess they blocked me. BTW I just called them again. I do this to EVERY call I get that is a fraud. GOD help the one that tries this on me that is within 4 hours driving distance. They will receive a personal visit from me and "Wembly" or me and my "BFR."

    The ONLY way to deal with bullies is to do exactly what you did, then step it up a bit, and if lucky, they will no longer contribute to the CO2 issues of this planet, and you can consider yourself a good steward of the planet.
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  • Posted by CTYankee 10 years, 1 month ago
    I'm a new Patent owner -- I'm looking for ways to monetize it. Would I be better off looking for hapless infringers or pursuing investment capital to help me bring the IP to fruition?

    Wink-wink I couldn't resist! :^)
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  • Posted by $ blarman 10 years, 1 month ago in reply to this comment.
    So in the article, they took the matter to court and the jury found them not guilty of infringement on all three assertions, so it would seem to me that the substantive complaints in the case were settled. I think we can reasonably conclude that no actual infringement took place and answer your question.
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  • Posted by jabuttrick 10 years, 1 month ago in reply to this comment.
    Excellent comments by both dbhalling and khalling. Evaluating the strength of positions in patent disputes is key to developing both a litigation strategy and settlement position. As noted, the expense of proceeding can be immense and the pressure to settle commensurate. But if you are sure of your position and a person of courage, then go for it.
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  • Posted by dbhalling 10 years, 1 month ago in reply to this comment.
    Only if he is right. I don't know if this guy believes all patents are B.S. I don't know if he did his due diligence (a patent search and opinion) before coming out with his product and the tone of the article suggests a knee-jerk reaction that implies he did not do his research after the charging letter. I am for reasoned responses. Once you are sure you have reason on your side, then I am looking for courage.
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  • Posted by khalling 10 years, 1 month ago in reply to this comment.
    Here's the deal. What he "feels " is irrelevant. Does he infringe? That takes hours of careful study most of the time. Then you strategize. Do app inventors do the due diligence? This "irrelevant technology" are they using it? Too many questions and few answers here, and we 're supposed to walk away with a feel good moment. Why?
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  • Posted by 10 years, 1 month ago in reply to this comment.
    I agree that we don't have enough info to judge the reasonableness/unreasonableness of this particular case, but wouldn't you really like to see some clients stand up as this guy says he did? I understand the big gamble, but if he really feels he's right?
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  • Posted by dbhalling 10 years, 1 month ago
    This article does not provide enough information to know whether the author is correct that he was the target of an unreasonable lawsuit or if he was actually just ignoring other people's property rights.

    My clients have been on both sides of these situations. Luckily, most of my clients have tried to be reasonable. In one case, the attorney on the other side refused to even discuss why they thought my client infringed and basically asked if we were willing to risk the cost of litigation. Note this is really a problem with the legal system generally and has nothing to do with patents specifically. Basically the attorney on the other side knew that the law is often an expensive crap shoot in court and his client was willing to play chicken with a million dollars. This is done in med malpractice suits, product liability suits, securities lawsuits, and a favorite tactic of many federal prosecutors and federal agencies. Don't blame patents, blame the absurdly expensive, ambiguous legal system we have.

    In the case of patents, the Supreme Court has gone out of their way to increase the uncertainty in patent lawsuits with their absurd opinions. Thus a bully is always willing to use this ambiguity in their favor. Whether you are a defendant or a plaintiff, be willing to stick your ground (within broad economic costs benefits) if you are sure you are right. That makes the system honest and deters bullies.
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  • Posted by khalling 10 years, 1 month ago
    " will pray tonight that karma is real, and that you are its worthy recipient, "
    um now we will bring the reality....

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