Is the Gulch possible in 2023?
I don't mean politically or where would the land come from, etc. I'm talking simply about feasibility and resources, human and otherwise. I'm referring to his maxim about doing the minimum you can (in the outside world) to sustain yourself, not "work for the looters", etc. Certainly in 1957 I would say impossible. Personally I disagree slightly with this part of Galt's (Rand's? I tend to use them interchangeably) philosophy. If I do better for myself, I'm working for myself and enjoying the benefits. As long as I'm not working free out of pure altruism for someone else, I don't see what the harm is IMHO. But back to the point...
We are not supposed to do anything that "supports the looters" which I take to mean just about any commerce in the outside world. If that's the case then to pull off an Atlantis in real life, it would have to be 100% self-sustaining. Just thinking of the movie since that's more modern, don't phones still have to come from the outside? Some building materials? Is there a hospital in the Gulch? Are there farms sufficient to make food production completely self-sustaining? Also the use of gold. I understand Galt said that Dagny was "broke" because she didn't carry around gold with her. Does that mean any gold from outside the gulch is no good? How would one notice the difference? Does that mean every coin was mined from within the gulch? There's still an exchange rate where one could buy gold on the outside and bring it in (personally I'd be for expanding the currency to silver and copper too for small purchases, but I digress...)
So to maintain the Gulch would require being 100% self-sustaining requiring no good, product, service, or raw material from the outside world. In 2023, unlike 1957, I think this IS theoretically possible since I believe there are enough producers from all industries necessary to survive. But I don't know if I can say the same for raw materials. There would have to be someone who has the skill and physical resources to build technology, lay telephone lines, put up cell towers, manufacture the phones and tablets and computers, enough farms to provide fruit, meat, and dairy for everyone. Hospital and medical/specialist services. Tall order. I think this is all in THEORY possible, whereas we could find enough producers to cover every field. A tech company like Samsung may have Galtian employees (Quentin Daniels types) but would they be able to produce the same in the Gulch? Would they have the facilities? The materials? Unless I'm getting Galt's philosophy wrong, his ideals in the Gulch would be next to impossible because at some point something must be needed from outside.
Thoughts?
We are not supposed to do anything that "supports the looters" which I take to mean just about any commerce in the outside world. If that's the case then to pull off an Atlantis in real life, it would have to be 100% self-sustaining. Just thinking of the movie since that's more modern, don't phones still have to come from the outside? Some building materials? Is there a hospital in the Gulch? Are there farms sufficient to make food production completely self-sustaining? Also the use of gold. I understand Galt said that Dagny was "broke" because she didn't carry around gold with her. Does that mean any gold from outside the gulch is no good? How would one notice the difference? Does that mean every coin was mined from within the gulch? There's still an exchange rate where one could buy gold on the outside and bring it in (personally I'd be for expanding the currency to silver and copper too for small purchases, but I digress...)
So to maintain the Gulch would require being 100% self-sustaining requiring no good, product, service, or raw material from the outside world. In 2023, unlike 1957, I think this IS theoretically possible since I believe there are enough producers from all industries necessary to survive. But I don't know if I can say the same for raw materials. There would have to be someone who has the skill and physical resources to build technology, lay telephone lines, put up cell towers, manufacture the phones and tablets and computers, enough farms to provide fruit, meat, and dairy for everyone. Hospital and medical/specialist services. Tall order. I think this is all in THEORY possible, whereas we could find enough producers to cover every field. A tech company like Samsung may have Galtian employees (Quentin Daniels types) but would they be able to produce the same in the Gulch? Would they have the facilities? The materials? Unless I'm getting Galt's philosophy wrong, his ideals in the Gulch would be next to impossible because at some point something must be needed from outside.
Thoughts?
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Much of what you describe is the normalcy of the everyday sot. Shit happens but I have always gotten what I need ,they think. I suspect some in California and Seattle and Chicago are learning different.
Written in 1962. No Island will be safe from the looters. Worth your time to read it.
Given how many don’t know how quickly Hiroshima and Nagasaki were recovered it is not a surprise. Most don’t realize that within one year we were rebuilding and repopulating them. Within a decade they were back to their original population and functionality.
Granted an air burst nuclear bomb is a bit different but even then these places aren’t dead zones for centuries.
Chernobyl didn’t even lose all of its population- many refused to leave and stayed there, most without the mongered outcomes. In fact not only is radiation less than in many civilized places the research shows little difference due to radiation. In fact arguably it is better for the wildlife now than before - much of which was the decrease in human activity.
But Kindle books can be deleted.
It doesn't delete the PDF Files!
Also, easy to store on USB, then copy over again.
It's very easy to recharge. Lasts a long time.
And takes little space.
And many things are not in printed book form
A 20% decline in sales at Amazon and MSFT and Apple and Walmart would be devastating.
That's one reason for the drive to get a Digital Currency.
"You MUST spend money at Amazon and Walmart or it will be removed from your account!"
I think we each can cut 20% out of our expenses without disastrous reductions in standard of living, but imagine what 20% reduction in GDP would do to the government coffers. It would cut their effective power substantially.
Punishment for that is yet to come.
I doubt that DC can be reformed.
The corruption and treason goes too deep and has been building for over 100 years.
The temple must be (figuratively) pulled down on their heads.
One thing he advised: Keep your hard copy books.
https://youtu.be/T_5CwiF-o8U?t=207
I'm adding to mine.
I say that, because we should NOT shy away from it. We must lean into it. This MUST BE A LINE that is not crossed. And, once again, SHAME on the USA for BOMBING a Nuclear Power Plant (that Russia is controlling in Ukraine). The LUNACY of these morons knows no bounds!
Although some medical books, and relatively intelligent people.
but TBH, I would prefer a SHAMAN to todays doctors when the lights go out!
Yes, todays "infrastructure" is the opiate of the masses.
The smart people I know are buying land.
I will be adding my living quarters to my buddies property. It will be his if I never need it.
But WHEN the SHTF, I have a place to go in the start of our own Gulch.
I am joining "resilience" communities, and we are sharing ideas.
While Solar is not a cost effective Electricity source vs. the power we get today.
It can certainly sustain basic things you might want to have running.
Nowadays, I value a property HIGHER with septic and a well...
The challenge, as you pointed out... Is that most people will be UNABLE to adapt to that lifestyle.
(Me, a solar panel, and a Kindle (or 5), loaded with PDF files of knowledge/entertainment goes a long way).
Being busy, working outside never bothered me.
Weigh that 'sacrifice' against "pledging our lives, our fortunes, and our sacred honor" to defend individual liberty.
Would you rather live in soviet Ukraine where some tyrant in a far away place decides your food
must be taken away and you will be left to starve to death?
That is the issue to consider.
"Live Free Or Die" is not a political slogan. It is approaching reality.
So accustomed to convenience that they believe it will never be taken away,
even though it is utterly obvious that the things that make such convenience
possible are being taken away every single day.
Sometimes people are so stupid, gullible, and willing to accept any insane
outrage (like governments' creation and release of deadly viruses and
mandating crippling 'vaccines') in order to keep their conveniences they disgust me.
Even the thought of giving up any modern convenience that addicts them
to enslavement is just too much effort and 'unrealistic' to be bothered with.
May their eventual chains of slavery rest so heavily that they are enlightened to action.
How could we possibly live without Amazon? Somehow we did 28 years ago.
How could we possibly live without smart cellphones? We did only 22 years ago.
How could federal government exist on only a Trillion a year? It did only 36 years ago.
At the height of Cold War military spending less than that was being spent.
SIX TIMES that amount is being WASTED by the looting scum in DC this year.
The Gulch is very difficult to create, and absolutely necessary for individual liberty.
Is the Russian nuclear contaminated area recovering?
Galt was right that the gulch had to be totally hidden, but that would be essentially impossible today with all the spy satellites. More than a few people would be detected like the waco and ruby ridge people were, and then would be destroyed.
Best we can do is reduce out standard of living to reduce the interactions that could be traced by the government. Living in small groups under the radar is about all we can do, and that would be at a substantially reduced standard of living.
There IS the passive and active revolution solution. First, we weaken the state by substantially reducing the GDP and therefore the taxation. Second, we develop an alternative method of wealth transfer enabling trade that cannot be traced by the government. Third, we stockpile and hide gold. After that is done, secession from the usa would be a reasonable solution, but it would be met by the remaining military as was the case in the first civil war. Thats my two cents.
The point is the scarcity it implies, but someone coming in with a huge amount could throw things off. Although, with like-minded people, I don't think as much.
Second, realize that this is 100% possible. Think in terms of natives living in untouched areas. Were not the Aborigine living in their Gulch? Were not the Native Indians? How about any islanders? Long lost civilizations?
The point being is that we confuse/conflate what it means to live, to living with an UNHEARD OF amount of luxury.
[Homo Sapiens have been around for > 1 Million Years... Yet only in the last 120 have we had Electricity, Indoor Plumbing, Technology, space travel, satellites, medical miracles, etc]. WE Are incredibly fortunate to be living through the "Human Singularity". At no time will ONE or TWO Generations witness the positive advances we have been born into!
So, imagine we found an island. Where we could raise cattle, and farm, and fish. But we had to downgrade away from most modern items. That Gulch is available, IMHO today... Probably for the taking.
Wasn't this tried in the M. Night Shyamalan move The Village? Was that not a GULCH?
==
Now, the big question is. Would it be BETTER if it had a Nuclear Power Plant, and 200yrs of Fuel?
Sure. But now you need Copper, Light Bulbs, etc.
And this is where we have to squint. At which point do we become the "Communism" that lives off of capitalism?
[If The Village had electricity, water, sewage, and technology piped in, it would "feel" like that, no?]
==
So, the Gulch, to me, is more about a community, living disconnected, on their own, with the fruits of their own labor. Rand was able to use the "Power Generation" of Galt's invention. But he stood on the shoulders of those who came before him. The airplanes they used to come and go? The "shield" to hide them. They were like writer's crutches, so she could tell the story.
Without them. They would have been living like Natives when we first landed in the Americas.
And compared to what we have now... I would PREFER THAT!
They would have stolen his company, too. That, I think, is the point she was making. You cannot trust the wolves that encircle you and promise to protect you. Especially when their other food sources dry up!
Apr 29, 2020 3:22:44 PM EDT
Q !!Hs1Jq13jV6 ID: c8f4dc No. 8963389
Read slowly and carefully.
Knowledge is power.
https://2009-2017.state.gov/documents...
>Irregular warfare is far more varied than conventional conflict: hence the importance of an intellectual framework that is coherent enough to provide guidance, and flexible enough to adapt to circumstances.
>American counterinsurgency practice rests on a number of assumptions: that the decisive effort is rarely military (although security is the essential prerequisite for success); that our efforts must be directed to the creation of local and national governmental structures that will serve their populations, and, over time, replace the efforts of foreign partners; that superior knowledge, and in particular, understanding of the ‘human terrain’ is essential; and that we must have the patience to persevere in what will necessarily prove long struggles.
>Insurgency, however, can and will flourish in the
modern environment. The strains created by globalization, by the collapse of weak state structures, by demographic, environmental, and economic pressures, by the ease of cooperation among insurgent groups and criminals, and by the appearance of destructive radical ideologies, all augur a period in which free and moderate governance is at risk.
[Insurgency is the organized use of subversion and violence to seize, nullify or chal- lenge political control of a region. As such, it is primarily a political struggle, in which both sides use armed force to create space for their political, economic and influence activities to be effective. Insurgency is not always conducted by a single group with a centralized, military-style command structure, but may involve a complex matrix of different actors with various aims, loosely connected in dynamic and non-hierarchical networks. To be successful, insurgencies require charismatic leadership, supporters, recruits, supplies, safe havens and funding (often from illicit activities). They only need the active support of a few enabling individuals, but the passive acquiescence of a large proportion of the contested population will give a higher probability of success. This is best achieved when the political cause of the insurgency has strong appeal, manipulating religious, tribal or local identity to exploit common societal grievances or needs. Insurgents seek to gain control of populations through a combination of persuasion, subversion and coercion while using guerrilla tactics to offset the strengths of government security forces. Their intent is usually to protract the struggle, exhaust the government and win sufficient popular support to force capitulation or political accommodation. Consequently, insurgencies evolve through a series of stages, though the progression and outcome will be different in almost every case.]
Q
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