I also went back and read where the south should save itself from itself. Sounds like some who consider themselves more intelligent really have the answer especially when trying to fix America's problems. That quote stands out and really has worked. No deficit, no unemployment, no diseases all is a utopia and nothing but gold and silver pour from everyone's pockets. And I have some land in Arizona you should consider. Faith is all that is needed. As a grain of Mustard seed. The smallest seed there is, but grows to one of the largest plants on earth. Some will agree some not. That was given to you at birth a conscience. Right from wrong wrong from right. A choice. If that choice I made a few years back is wrong then it is mine and only mine. I was told to just tell you the truth about a man that lived over 2000 years ago that knew you before you were born. I do not think I have harmed anyone or have put to death anyone in what I have quoted. An atheist only quotes there is no God. I believe that quote blows itself out of the water. If the atheist even mentions there is no God then he is just blinded to the fact of that belief. Only God can change his belief not me or 50% or 99% of people of faith. It is a choice. I believe God has used Ayn Rand to help us here in the Gulch to understand what truth is. Why? So people like me will understand truth.

barwick11, my husband is a very intense Christian. He has spent many hours in his 80 years of life poring over the Bible in its many translations. His conclusions are not fixed in stone even now--he has found too many mis-translations--his quote is, "All of God's Word is in the Bible, but not all of the Bible is God's Word." He is beginning to believe that the only answer will come when he meets the Man face to face. Please try not to explode because some don't believe the same as you do. If you attack, you will be answered, and it should not surprise you--we're all under attack if we write something someone else disagrees with! How else can we learn, if not to discuss with those of different views?

Sorry I meant weather deadline.

That is an interesting assertion "... on the unchanging Word of God". If one postulates the existence of God then it could follow that His word is unchanging, presuming He did not want to change it. In either case (changed or unchanged) it would still be possible (and even likely) that humans would argue the point (and we certainly have a lot of evidence that they do.)

@brd76 - I love this quote.

Again you're correct.
However, I've had lots of discussions with folks who start off with, "I'm a Christian, but....."

What you write is true in the circumstances you posit. Perhaps, you've not participated in as many religion vs non-religion as I have. In any case, it really doesn't matter as far as I'm concerned so long as you are rational in dealing with your fellow man and do not impede my forward progress.

As I indicated, the vast majority couldn't care less, until some militant group on either side does something to stir things up. Personally, I am a non-militant agnostic. Formal religion, to me, seems irrational and is the cause, often, of the very things it claims to want to cure. The only reason that I'm not a total atheist is that science has way too many unanswered questions, especially in the quantum world.

A gun, a philosophy or a religion can be used to accomplish both good and evil. Religion, just like philosophy is not inharently good or evil. It is the minds of those that use it that use it for good or evil.

A gun accomplishes much good in the world when used correctly by mind intent on doing good. Religion is no different.

A core common value system is required for a society to be moral. Religion has been the source of that core common value system. I know of no replacement for it.

To say that religion is used for evil is like saying political science is used for evil or a large corporation is used for evil. All of the above have done great good and great evil and great good.

To blame the heinous crime on the religion is foolish. Its irrational and destructive. Is its religion fault that men used it to cease power and oppress people?

Were now using science and technology to do the same. In less obvious or barbaric ways no real difference. You have no privacy, there is very little respect of personal choice or property. Every thing you say, do and every place you go recorded to be used against you if the powers that be want to do so. Its just using science to accomplish the same thing.

There will always be those that want to build a society that allows them to use force to stay at the top of that society. Reguardless of the age and what weapon is available (psychology, philosophy, science, religion or politics) they will be used for freedom, property rights protection, liberty and the protection of life and the opposite. This has always been the case because some men choose to make it so (on both sides). The tools of the centuries change but the two sides remain the same.

Without something that clearly defines what behaviors are desirable, praise worthy and to be sought after you have people seeking after nothing specifically. Religion provides to the masses a definition of what is desirable, praise worthy and to be sought after. So long as it leaves people with the choice to act on it of there own mind, it will be good to have around.

As I put forth, that perhaps 10 to 15% feel that way. Most Christians and Jews usually don't think about atheism until the atheists do something stupid like removing the 10 Commandments from a public place. Likewise, I rarely have heard the word atheist spoken without disdain.

Yes. It reminds me of reading Erving Goffman 25 years ago.