you no longer can hold your own values in America

Posted by MaxCasey 11 years, 4 months ago to News
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you are no longer able to chose to exercise your values in America. You now run the risk of being forced to become a hypocrite by the government. Whether you agree with gay marriage or not, this baker should not be forced to work for people he chooses not too.


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  • Posted by Hiraghm 11 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Yes, thank you for pointing out that we have some laws which exceed Constitutional authority.

    So, there were these white kids and black kids arguing over who was going to sit next to whom, and so on.

    The bus driver, he's had enough of the bickering and says to the kids, "Look! I'm tired of this stuff! Nobody's black or white on this bus! You're all... green! Y'got that? You're all GREEN!"

    "Now... all you light green kids go to the front of the bus, and all you dark green kids go to the back of the bus..."
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  • Posted by $ Maphesdus 11 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    If they came in full KKK regalia, the owner could refuse service on the grounds of inappropriate dress, justified on the same grounds as "No Shirt, No Shoes, No Sevice." ;)
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  • Posted by Hiraghm 11 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    It is if she accepts the sexual advances of someone else.

    Suppose she spurns my advances but accepts the advances of a man who happens to be of another race? That's racism, isn't it?
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  • Posted by $ Maphesdus 11 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    The problem with saying that rights come from God is that they are not written down anywhere except in legislative documents. The Bible makes no mention of rights, nor does any other religious holy book. If rights are truly pre-existing, how do you know what they are?
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  • Posted by Hiraghm 11 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I don't see how it could be a 'flaw' in her philosophy, since, per her philosophy, there's no way for her to avoid opposing it.

    You want to guarantee the perpetuation and survival of bigotry? Force people to associate with others when they don't wish to. Resentments will build.
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  • Posted by $ Maphesdus 11 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Actually, fascism declared homosexuality to be illegal, punishable by death. This is about as far away from that as you could possibly get.
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  • Posted by $ Maphesdus 11 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Personally, I would have filed a lawsuit and then gone to a different bakery. I wouldn't want any food products produced under such circumstances, but that doesn't mean I'd let the baker/cook get away with discrimination. Financial compensation is a sastisfactory method of justice.
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  • Posted by Hiraghm 11 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Pleasure is NOT THE GOAL.

    Two animals may fuck because they want the high, just as an animal may shoot up heroin because he wants the high, That doesn't make pleasure the PURPOSE or the FUNCTION of the ACT.

    I guess I have to teach bio 101 to you. See, daddy gets excited, and puts his thingy in mommy's special place, and pretty soon the drugs are released in his brain and he squirts his sperm into her.
    IF she's in her fertile period (which in most mammals occurs during certain parts of the year), there will be an egg available for the sperm to invade. The resulting zygote becomes embedded in the wall of mommy's special place, and 9 months later she pushes out a baby.

    This is the function of these organs. This is the function of the desire, of the endorphin rush, the addiction. To perpetuate the species. That it is not 100% successful all the time is a tribute to the sloppy nature of evolution.

    You don't need to invoke God, though I am amused that you feel comfortable heaping scorn on religion but get your back up when I describe the true nature of homosexuality.

    Did God create hunger? What is the function of hunger? To induce one to seek food and to eat. What is the purpose of the feeling of satiation? Again, to induce one to seek food and to eat.

    This does not require divine intervention on the part of the Almighty. Hunger, thirst, lust, love, hate, envy, remorse, compassion, fear, cold, heat, loneliness, fellowship... all these feelings can be the inevitable result of the evolutionary process. If one doesn't ever get hungry,one doesn't eat, one dies. If one doesn't ever get thirsty, one doesn't drink, one dies. If hunger is particularly unpleasant for one, one is more intent upon seeking food. If sex is pleasurable for one, one seeks it more frequently and intently.

    It doesn't matter why one has kids; evolution doesn't care about why, just so it happens.

    My position assumes nothing about any intelligent designer.
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  • Posted by $ Maphesdus 11 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    You would have to pass a law declaring schizophrenia to be a legally protected status first, which is unlikely to happen.
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  • Posted by $ Maphesdus 11 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Well, if you're an employee of Target, the management could certainly compell you to wax the floors. I suppose you could choose to disobey, but that would result in negative financial consequences of no longer having a job.

    Also, the regulations which govern the behavior of an employee must naturally be different from the regulations which govern the employer.
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  • Posted by Hiraghm 11 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Yes, people can derive a great deal of physical pleasure from masturbation as well... it's not the same thing.

    Sure, I'll get out more. Want to visit some BDSM clubs? Maybe we could visit a chapter meeting of NAMBLA? Or we could visit the zoo, if that's your thing.

    There's no such thing as homosexual "couples". The children in question have a father, who is male (and who can be made legally responsible for them, in a wry twist of injustice). That they are denied their father is just yet another example of the failing of the mental/emotional illness.

    What you are talking about is an application of technology. An application of technology attempting to get around the facts of nature.
    A crutch to compensate for mental/emotional crippling.

    That you like someone who suffers from homosexuality doesn't cure them. There are mental hospitals filled with people who are loved by someone; it doesn't cure them of their various problems. There are people out on the street with phobias, paranoias, obsessions, fetishes, who are loved by their friends and relatives. Doesn't make the phobias, paranoias, obsessions or fetishes go away.
    The same is true of sexual deviancy.
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  • Posted by $ Maphesdus 11 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Ayn Rand's stance against the Civil Rights Act was one of the single biggest flaws in her philosophy. The Act was good.
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    Posted by $ Maphesdus 11 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I don't think you understand what discrimination is. A woman who chooses not to return your sexual advances is not discriminating against you.
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  • Posted by $ Mimi 11 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    The original premise of equal rights was to allow businesses that wanted to serve black customers in cities and towns that lived under Jim Crow laws, not to force other businesses that wanted to discriminate to be forced to do otherwise. The civil rights movement changed our views and the way we interpreted the law. Clearly, we are now exploiting the law, and have gone too far in the opposite direction of what is healthy and reasonable because there is no such thing as an completely egalitarian society.
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  • Posted by $ Mimi 11 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    You didn’t answer the question. Can a prostitute refuse to service a client?
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  • Posted by khalling 11 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    agreed that prostitution should be legal. The baker is "owned" if forced to perform. duh
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  • Posted by plusaf 11 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    Oh, ps....
    Ever meet any homosexual couples who have BORNE children (yes, the females can and do) or adopted children to raise as "their own"?

    Homosexuality "denies them the reward of mating and producing" is more BS, since (I trust) they can achieve a lot of pleasure from "mating activities" even if a person of the opposite gender is not there, AND they DO produce young!

    In fact two of my favorite people in the world did exactly that. They have twins, and they call one "Mom" and they other "Mommy" and their kids are two of the nicest, brightest kids I know.

    Get out more.
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  • Posted by airfredd22 11 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    For that matter, he could have been an Atheist and simply find homosexuality distasteful or simply believe that marriage should be between a man and a woman as it has been for eternity before this permissive age. It seems that no one is allowed to speak up for traditions or personal beliefs. marriage and homosexuality have existed side by side since the dawn of man, but now it's discriminatory to voice your beliefs?

    Fred
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  • Posted by plusaf 11 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    ... which just proves my point that PLEASURE is the goal in BOTH cases (drugs and sex) and anything more than that is pure projection.

    Of course, if your belief system includes the idea of a Creator Whose Hand Is In The Game at all times, He/She obviously made sex pleasurable so His/Her Creations would "be fruitful and multiply."

    Your position assumes a Prime Mover Designer who built the system with that purpose. If there is one, sure! If not, your argument falls apart.

    Maybe a SurveyMonkey poll is in order..
    "Why do/did you have children?
    o Perpetuate the species
    o It was an accident
    o Wanted to bring wonderful children into the world
    o Other ______

    That should be fun!
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  • Posted by $ Mimi 11 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    I once did a literary review on Pompadour. I had to read tens of biographies. I have no idea what you are talking about. Link, please.
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  • Posted by airfredd22 11 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    This so called right when implemented through law, just breeds a greater resistance to those laws. It is unnatural and immoral for a law to interfere with natural rights. The right to associate with whomever you wish, is one of those inalienable rights and no man made law can change that.

    Fred
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  • Posted by Hiraghm 11 years, 4 months ago in reply to this comment.
    So if the woman willingly has sex with her husband or boyfriend, it's okay for you to rape her as she walks down the street?

    She can't discriminate between you and her husband, after all.
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